Thursday, November 29, 2007

When Black Men Break Up


You find hip hop in the oddest places. Perusing NY MAG I came across
interview with one of Jay's old school homies, De-Haven Irby.

Jay has a his share of public falling outs recently.

First Jaz.

Then Dame.

Then Lance.


Now De-Haven.

Now, you and I know that we fall out with our friends.
Thats natural, it happens, you move on, you get older,
life changes.

But what makes this story interesting is the same thing that made
YeYe's Big Brother interesting. Jay is personal in his albums to the extent that
he wants to be. But, for the most part, he keeps his personal life,
hood relations etc, out the media.

So, when people beef with him publicly it gives us and eye into
the intricacies of his relationship, and into Jay on gp.

And the fact that these are BLACK men that we are talking
about adds another layer as well.

I read the following paragraph and totally felt De-Haven. I remember
f*cking with TL and it being all good, just uber chemistry. We had an
exchange that at the time seemed benign BUT from then out out
everything flat lined. There was a part of me that wanted to know
WHAT HAPPENED at least for a good three weeks after. I mean,
ya'll read the blog, I spoke on it in March. So here is De-Haven's words,

When did the two of you have a falling-out?
We never really had a falling-out, that’s the problem. This is why I’m so confused. There was no argument, there was none of that. I don’t want an apology [from him], I want a reason. What happened? When my case [a federal drug-conspiracy charge] came in 1998, I never seen him again too much anymore. The case had nothing to do with him, his name never came up, so I’d like to ask him, “What happened?” Where did his departure come from?
De-Haven has actually polly'd with Jaz on J, saying,
One of Jay’s former collaborators Jaz-O also has beef with Jay, and former drug dealer Calvin Klein also accuses Jay of appropriating his story.
Me and Jaz sat down and had a long talk not too long ago. Jaz has a right to have a beef. Jaz was there in the beginning. Jaz took him away from the projects and put him in the studio first. Big Daddy Kane had a lot to do with his career too, and he’s not showing no kinda love to him neither. With Klein, if Jay told him he “got him,” then Klein got a right to be mad.
I was surprised when J actually MENTIONED him on American Gangster.
“Fuck De-Haven for cavin’, that's why we don't speak,” he raps. “Made men ain't supposed to make statements. End of the story, I followed the code, cracked the safe. Other niggas ain't in the game so they practice hate. Leave that boy Hov alone, why don't ya.”
Does Jay really owe this dude cake, EVEN IF JAY lifted his stories?

Does Jay exaggerate his drug-dealing in his songs?
I’m telling you he overexaggerates. He was there to see things, but doing some big-time Frank Lucas–type thing? No. He nickled and dimed, but nothing on a major scale. He definitely didn’t sell nothin’ in Marcy. Spanish Jose, who he mentions a lot [in his songs], was a friend of mine. Jay didn’t have no affiliation to Spanish Jose.

You’re saying Jay appropriated your story?
He says it himself. He’s been talking about me since day one, on a lot of his albums. He mentioned me on The Black Album, and I hadn’t seen him in years.

I mean, it was ultimately his creation. Jay put in the work and made it happen.

And even if De-Haven gave J "source material" how do you go about
compensating someone for that?


As an emcee, how many of the people, from you old block deserve to
eat with you?

What is the criteria for cutting someone off?



neo said...

Jay never beefed with Ye' (at least its not the kind of beef on the level of Dame, Jaz, Dehaven or Klein's claims) moreso a misunderstanding in my opinion...

I saw where Dehaven was coming from but it just looked desperate, you have a DVD and some other stuff lined up based on the "quarrel" you have with your man 'cos you feel he owes you money for being his inspiration? I don't get it...that's not what a friend should do. I mean if you have a problem you go to the man and speak face to seems sometimes these guys love to work out their problems in the pub eye..and Jay being the reserved cat he is typically shies away from this stuff except through song only when its extreme, hence the Dehaven AG reference...and that was after the fact Dehaven came at him incorrect through the youtube stuff.

Only folk that deserve eating with me are my immediate fam and friends that lent a helping hand in some way. However if someone lends you a helping hand like give you some start up money for a label and says, "hey man don't worry about paying me, in fact don't pay me." I def will look out for him on some, you know "dude did something nice for me so I'mma bless him back" but not owe him for the rest of my career, nope, never that 'cos at the end of the day I had to believe in God, in me to turn this talent into cds and change.

I typically don't cut ppl off, can't remember when last I did that honestly. I avoid folk with whom I don't share much in common with any longer, like ppl who I knew growing up but we're like worlds apart spiritually, mentally and such like..but that's about it.

Model Minority said...

I mean if you have a problem you go to the man and speak face to face.

But J ain't fuckin w. him.

You never responded re Houston.

but not owe him for the rest of my career
You black people be having that shit bad.

We stay thinking somebody owes us something.

The cut off is a hard call.

Model Minority said...

I didn't mean "you black people."

But, YO, black people be having that shit bad.

James Manning said...

As far as I know there are no rules when it comes to paying someone back for inspiring them...Hell, it's a lot of cats that owe Michael Jordan and Spike Lee big if that is the case.

Obviously dude was that close with J or he would have kicked him something. Stop the hate and elevate...

neo said...

I replied..

I can't host y'all, would love to but with zero furniture I'd hate to have y'all lie down on carpet..

however, if y'all do come out I can third wheel here and there with y'all..lemme know su'in. You got my number no?

Model Minority said...


You ignorant Negro.

We GOT spots.

We just trynna kick it with yo lame ass at the Breakfast club.

BUT if you are having a hard time deciphering Blog*t...
I might have to rescind....


Kai said...

D-haven and many of these cats need to move on. Jay has a number of fractured relationships, and in at least some of them (Jaz, Dame) he appears to have made some bad decisions, imo. Regardless, you have to move on. I had an idea for some t-shirts once, shared it with a friend and he RAN with it, pressed up shirts, had a whole line going. I was salty at first, but then had to look at myself and sya I didn't move on the idea so what could I be mad about?

Nigga rapped about you and he owes you? It would be nice if he looked out, if yall were as close as you say, but if he doesn't move on. Putting out a DVD to tell about someone having crabs is a bitch move. There are alot of ways to make money on this country, pick one, or get a job and take care of your family. You can't take credit for Jay's career.

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